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Author:  yossi
E-mail:  yossiaz@aol.com
Date:  8/22/2002 12:10:00 PM
Subject:  Mezonot roll on a roll
Message:  Rabbi:

Thank you for replying. I’m sorry for wasting your time but I just want to get to the bottom of this issue. (Sorry for bringing Rabbi Forst in on this, but I felt he presented a clear explanation for why Mezonot rolls should be hamotzee.) If you wish, leave him out of it.

If the basis of your (or your fathers) opinion is the Rama who holds that so much fruit juice must be included that its taste must be recognized, I would reply, that’s fine for the Rama. However, Maran is lenient there and holds that as long as the juice comprises a majority of the liquid ingredients, its mezonot. (“Mechanically”, Sepharadim follow the pesaq of Maran over that of the Rama.)

If you base your opinion on the fact that “It looks like bread, it tastes like bread, it smells like bread, and it's eaten like bread”, then I would answer that that is precisely why Ashkenazim make a hamotzee on matza. Yet virtually all Sephardic poseqim (yes, even before the Mishna Berura), hold that matza is mezonot, regardless of how I decide to treat it. (Believe me, it would be very convenient to whip out 2 sheets of matza on Shabbat for my lehem mishne, but, unlike my Ashkenazic brethren, I can’t.) That implies to me that according to Sepharadim, there are objective criteria that determine the status of pat haba’a bekisnin, and not the consideration of how people look at it, eat it, smell it or treat it.

Then you might argue that since mezonot rolls are eaten together with other meal type foods, then we must add up all the food eaten together with the roll in order to determine Keviat Se’uda. I would reply that, as is mentioned in the Mishna Berura, (I hope I’m not too late, there. By the way when is the cut off for a quoted opinion to be considered legitimate? I’m thinking 1920?) that is subject of a mahaloqet between the Sha’agat Aryeh, The Gra, and others (before Mishna Berura) about whether such a se’uda must consist of 3-4 eggs worth, or the amount of food that would completely satiate someone. Even according to the lenient opinion, a typical airline meal is nowhere near 3-4 kebetzim. And even if you claim that such a meal is somehow 3 kebetzim (maybe the flight attendants gave a whole box of extra peanuts), the Mishna Berura concludes that Maran implies that he holds of the latter opinion.

I hope I wasn’t too winded there. I gave three possible arguments and three responses. I don’t require you or your father to agree, just to give a logical basis for your (his) opinion.

Kol Tuv,


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